Parramatta Radio Control Aircraft Club
Radios - Printable Version

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Radios - corsair_pilot - 05-03-2012

Sorry wasn't sure if there was a recentish thread or not on radios.
I did have a quick look, but couldn't see anything.
I was looking at the Spektrum Radios, and was going to go with their 8ch version, but I have since been offered a really good deal on a Futaba model.
Is one better than the other? Does it make a massive difference?
I'm happy to spend a bit more, if I'm actually getting something that is that much better.

RE: Radio's - gbanger - 05-03-2012

The Futaba radio's are arguably the the best on the market, their receivers however are a lot more expensive than the Spectrums and if you get hooked on the hobby then you will be spending a lot more money on receivers to outfit you fleet. You are also a lot more likely to find Spectrum receivers at swap meets and online at reduced prices than the Futaba's as they are not as popular because of their price. Dont let that put you off though they are great radios.
They use a different operating system to the Spectrums so if you deciede to chance from one to the other at any time you will have to unlearn everything you have learned and start over. By the way only 4 or 5 of our club members fly with Futaba so if you what to buddy box to learn to fly you will find it hard to get someone to assist you.
Hope this helps.....now your confused eh!!!! sorry bout that.

RE: Radio's - wingtipper - 05-03-2012

THE CONSENSUS , FROM THE CLUB SEEMS TO BE SPECTRUM . one thing ive recently noticed getting back into the hobby which is now crystal less , and electric . that there are many different plugs , receivers , servos , esc connections, battery connectors etc , RADIOS seem to be no different ,
my advice is to make your choice early and then stick to it , cause changing over requires more money and time , and even then you'll end up making , or buying connector adaptors for plugs and batteries etc etc . radios though are a little more advanced in this application . for this reason , i stuck with the flyers advice and went with the majority on spectrum , glad i did , cause only later am i finding out about all this, different compatibility issues , ( not much is controlled with a standard ) MY SPECTRUM DXi 6 is more than i want at this stage , with 10 model memory and programablbe mixes and dual rates galore , with the function to fly heli or aero , leaves me wrapped , much more the the HI TECH FLASH 5 i adored many year ago , and its about 1/3rd the price . if you want better go the DXI 8 OR 9 . these things you'll be polishing every night and putting them in thier silk lined cases !!!!
same applies with FUTABA no doubt but as has been said , compliance will be more difficult for spares and sales due to lower numbers in the club using this gear . these days we are spoilt for choice .

RE: Radio's - secant0give - 05-03-2012

I must say I really like FRsky receivers they have excellent range and have functioned perfectly out over 500m. Some people use them out over 1.5Km. They are cheep and very high quality diversity type receivers this means they are like two receivers built into one and the one with the best reception is chosen dynamically to provide the control signal. They also have telemetry so you can set alarms to monitor your flight pack voltage and your received signal strength while you plane is in the air.
They will work plug and play with any JR or futaba transmitter that has a separate module for the RF circuit. You can also get a hack kit to replace the RF board in just about any TX.

All of my bigger models fly with an FRSky RC link and operate perfectly every time. Tjhese receivers have some other innovative features the 7 channel RX has a composite out put on the eighth channel so you can connect it to an auto stabilizer and it connects all channels with one plug. You can also link two of them together and have a 14 channel receiver.

The best thing is the price a TX module and a receiver with Telemetry for $38.00
AWSOME !!!

I guess I've just thrown a spanner in the works Smile
The thing is to get a new radio that takes modules will probably cost you a little more

You'll want a new JR like this, and they are certainly worth the extra bucks
http://www.modelflight.com.au/products/JR_PCM_9X_V2_LTD_TRANSMITTER_W_RS10DS_RECEIVER_W_CRYSTALS_NO_CHARGER-794-15.html

Or if you can find a second hand X388S or PCM 10 then that will work very well with the FRSky module. I Have an Old X388S I use like this and it's a beautie !!

RE: Radio's - Skidz - 06-03-2012

I think either is fine personally. There are bind n fly kits out there that come with Spektrum receivers preinstalled that requires a Futaba user (me) to remove and replace ($).

I bought Futaba as I fly expensive helicopters. I bought it when Spektrums were being criticised for signal problems (brown outs, black outs). That's all fixed and I haven't seen a radio problem on a spektrum with a genuine receiver. Futabas also have some very neat helicopter functions and the model I purchased (T8FG) had super fast frame rates (tx speed).

The Futaba is fantastic and if I had my time over I'd buy it again. I guess in the end it is a "Holden v Ford" argument. Both are good but one is better - just depends who you ask!



RE: Radio's - corsair_pilot - 06-03-2012

Thanks guys.
Its just been difficult, i've been offered the spectrum DX8 with the telemetry receiver for about $452 and also the Futaba 12ch with 8ch receiver for about the same price.
I will take it all on board though. I do like the idea of having the spektrum, simply because so many of you guys run with them, and it would just make life easier when buddy boxing.
I think I will continue to wait, and come down to the field and have a look and a feel and then go from there. At least then i can see the difference and get an idea what is around.


RE: Radio's - secant0give - 06-03-2012

It might also be worthwhile to note here that JR and Spectrum are 100% compatible as far as the buddy cable goes. Even my old X388S buddies with DX6i just fine.

RE: Radio's - corsair_pilot - 06-03-2012

Well now that throws a spanner in the works!!
I will have a look again. I'm not against the Spektrum, think it was a great radio, until recently had been having issues finding one at a price that I liked.
I suppose worse case scenario I could have more than one depending on what I'm flying at the time.

RE: Radio's - robair - 06-03-2012

Gday Jonathan

There a a few of us with DX8's, great tx, lots of functionality, compatable with DSM2 and DSMX. The SD slot lets you upgrade the firmware easily when "upgrades" are released.
The telemetry feature is also pretty cool!
I'd have a chat to Gazz though, he scored a great deal from o'seas on the JR11X 0 that was only a bit more then the DX8.
I am kicking myself that I didn't go down the same road at the time as my Viper Jet has eaten the 8 channels. Moral of the story, don't under-estimate the channels you may need in the future, otherwise you will find yourself mixing and y-leading at a mad rate.

Cheers
Rob B


RE: Radio's - corsair_pilot - 06-03-2012

This was the Futaba deal I was looking at.
Specifications

Futaba 2.4GHz Integrated System 8FG 14 channel with 8 Channel receiver
rc radio system futaba brand
transmitter receiver
Specification

2.4GHz ss Futaba Advanced Spread Spectrum Technology

Features:
Backlit 128 x 64 LCD Screen
10 Character Model and User Name
20 Model Memory
SD Card Slot
NiMH Battery
Sensor Touch Programming
Digital Trims
Audible Alarm
Airplane/Helicopter/Glider Selectable
Package Contents

1 x Futaba 2.4GHz Integrated System 8FG 14 channel Digital Proportional R/C System
1 x 8 Channel receiver Serial Bus System
1 x Futaba Battery Charger
1 x Three-wire switch
1 x belt
1 x English manual

I can get it all for about $450

RE: Radio's - gbanger - 06-03-2012

Sounds like a magic deal Jonathan..
I think both systems have pro's and con's. I have even thought about changing over to Futaba once or twice. But I have stayed with spectrum ( I use a JR11X Zero) because they are easy to use.
My final comment is, go with what ever lights your fire but most importantly..... make up your own mind

RE: Radio's - Skidz - 06-03-2012

Well, I am going with Jonathan simply because he wants the same radio as the one I have. I could hardly criticise such taste. It's a great radio and good to see it has the charger. Mine didn't. I charge mine on the NiMH setting on the normal battery charger. I charge every few weeks as the battery is pretty good. Be careful connecting that receiver in to low spec planes. They may use analog servos. That receiver will fry them if your not careful as it is high speed digital as default. You need to select a different mode.

The 8FG has a neat snap roll switch.

Be careful if you buy OS. If you have any problems, you will have to send it back there for warranty support. The local Futaba reps, Perth RC, would require Australian Tax invoice for warranty support. All is cool if your deal is within Australia.

I am trying to think of one thing I don't like about the 8FG ... ... ... ... nope, got nothing.

RE: Radio's - smuzz - 06-03-2012

Yeh, well, after the brand of transmitter is finally decided upon, the next question is of course ..... the MODE Biggrin

RE: Radio's - corsair_pilot - 06-03-2012

I had been thinking throttle on the left. Guess it depends on how I learn n what I start with.

RE: Radio's - smuzz - 06-03-2012

Yes, throttle on the left is mode 2.

You'll need to experiment and see which mode comes more naturally to you. I got a cheap $20 simulator and fake transmitter set to play with when I was starting - I spent about a month trying to get my head around mode 1, but just couldn't do it - had to go mode 2 with the elevator and aileron on the one stick on the right. There are of course pros and cons on the mode selection too ... I expect you'd have guessed there would be, by now.

RE: Radio's - corsair_pilot - 06-03-2012

From playing with cheap helicopters around the house I'm used to controlling throttle with the left hand. I guess my downfall there is, that it also controlled elevation of the helo, hmmm all the options! Dealing with bikes n bike parts was so much easier! Haha

RE: Radio's - secant0give - 07-03-2012


There are of course pros and cons on the mode selection too ... I expect you'd have guessed there would be, by now.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Not the least of which is that you will want to buddy up to another radio and I think that most people fly mode 1. Am I right here?


If you get the futaba radio will you limit your options to buddy to another radio even further??
I'm not sure how they go buddying up with spectrum/JR ??

Kizza does fly either mode but I'm not sure if he has a futaba or a JR compatible radio. I suspect he's got a Graupner that's JR compatible but I'm not 100% sure. He may have both.

It may pay to ask the club instructors what radios they have and what modes they are happiest training in

??...............Perhaps You guys could post this up for Jonathan.

Gazz has already posted that he flys JR and his signature says he flys mode 1.



RE: Radio's - Skidz - 07-03-2012

Jason,

When you buddy, it doesn't matter what modes the radios are. When you buddy, you can't mix brands as the transmission protocols are different. The only option in that situation is the club trainer plane which has dual receivers.

There are more Spektrum/JR users but there are enough Futaba users too.

Dave

RE: Radio's - corsair_pilot - 07-03-2012

Before I buy anything, including radios, I'm planning on paying a visit to the club, and check things out and I guess actually watch some of you guys control your aircraft, and see what could work.
Was also thinking about spending money on the cheap transmitter simulator combo. At least give a quick idea of what I do or don't like.
I will get phoenix later when i have a the real radio. I think I have a pretty good idea now of what is out there, and what I should be looking out for.
I do like the Futaba simply for the extra channels it does provide me down the track.
That being said, if it doesn't rain between now and the weekend, anyone planning on being down at the strip over the weekend?

RE: Radio's - wingtipper - 07-03-2012

dont remember how i ended up as mode 1 user . but i remember finding out about mode 2 afterwards and thought it was rediculous !!!!! .
the best thing about this hobby is the amount of selections and work you have to put into it . choices and modifications are essential .

RE: Radio's - BenR - 07-03-2012

Another option for training is to look at a site like Dealextreme - they sell a very cheap (US$15?) USB adapter for hooking up a controller for simulation/training - but you need to have bought a reciever to plug into it.

The USB may also come with some unofficial software......

RE: Radio's - corsair_pilot - 07-03-2012

Hey Dave,
I have a couple of helicopter questions from my dad.
He enjoyed flying around those little indoor ir helicopter. Up down back forward.
He then got himself a 4 channel helicopter. I don't know if it is still ir or radio. He is having many issues flying it, and being able to set the trims up correctly. He paid about $200 for it in Indonesia, so i suspect it is a good one, and supplied with a radio.
Any hints to at least get him hovering, as he seems to get it up and then crash....

RE: Radio's - RC_Pilot - 07-03-2012

Does his helicopter have two large rotor blades on top of each other (called a coaxial helicopter) or does it have one rotor on the top and one on the tail?

RE: Radio's - corsair_pilot - 07-03-2012

Very good question, I did ask him a few questions about it, but never thought of that. I do believe that it is a single bladed an not coaxial.


RE: Radio's - Skidz - 07-03-2012

Jonathan,

I will be there on the weekend provided the weather holds. Can't guarantee anything these days - other than it will rain.

Re your dad's helicopter, there could be a set up issue but I'd wager that he is crashing as he hasn't practised enough (yet). Unlike planes, which you can fly albeit badly as a rank novice, helicopters won't. They are just plain hard to fly in the early days. Without knowing details (what behaviour is causing the crash), it could be main rotor link issues as they need to be set up perfectly or they fly wonky - which then leads promptly to a crash. Maybe you can find out brand/model and a few clues as to what it is doing wrong. I can google the model details and see if I can help. I guess your dad is nowhere local right?

I'll take a punt and say that he has moved from the dead easy to fly micro coaxial IR controlled unit (that can't hover as they always fly forward) to a collective pitch model with more power and is bigger. Coaxials are very stable and literally hang under the blades. One must learn only to control power. Collective pitch helicopters have to be kept level as they are unstable and want to fly away (and out of control). It now has cyclic controls, pitch controls, rudder, throttle etc. Learning to hover a collective pitch helicopter is like balancing a ball bearing on a sheet of glass the size of a book (with two servos to control the tilt from your radio). Very hard to do. Could be just a practise issue. All guesses here, no real idea on the crashing.


RE: Radio's - corsair_pilot - 07-03-2012

I'll be speaking to him later tonight. I knnow that it is a 4ch helicopter, still a micro but none the less, I'm sure it is still a lot more powerful than his old coaxial job!!
When I've spoken to him I'll post a few more things. I'll look at getting him on here as well when he gets back home.
Sadly he lives in Indonesia, and wont be able to make it out to the field. I believe they will be out here in May, and if he is, I'll get him to come along and bring the heli as well.
He will be a self taught, and yes the jump up is big.
Hi Dave,
I've just found out its an E-flite 120SR.
When trying to fly, was taking off on carpet, applying throttle slowly would rotate and tilt.
I think part of his problem with initial flight was a the surface, and also he wasn't aware of the need to neutralise inputs. When he applied the throttle, he was using the trim setting to try and stop from rotating. I the end i think it all happened too quickly.
I've emailed him the link to this forum and a few other bits of information. So he should be on here within the next few days as well.

RE: Radio's - Skidz - 07-03-2012

That's quite a decent heli. I have the cousin - mCPx - which is collective pitch. The Blade 120SR is fixed pitch so my ramblings on collective pitch don't apply to your dad.

Carpet can be sticky so the tilting is likely from gyroscopic processional forces. He needs to give the throttle a bit more "stick" and get the heli off the ground. It will then lift off clean. Hesitation at the point of lift off for any RC heli can get "interesting".

BTW. If you prang the heli lots and dag up the blades, they don't work right. Ask me how I know.

RE: Radio's - corsair_pilot - 08-03-2012

HI Dave,
I do suspect that was part of his problem, he just didn't give it enough gas, and when he does pannics and kills the gas.
I think from my conversation with him last night he's done a bit more damage than just the rotors.
However you have got me interested, how do you know?

RE: Radio's - Skidz - 08-03-2012

I have four helicopters: 1 x Logo 600, 1 x Align Trex 500, 1 x HK450 and 1 x Blade mCPx. I have crashed the 450 three times. There I learned the art of looking for small metal pieces of metal heads. No other crashes on the 500 or 600 over 100's of flying hours. Enter the mCPx...

I decided to try all those moves you wouldn't normally try. Bang! Crash! Smash! Poor old blades copped a hiding. Canopy looking very sad. Flew like a pregnant duck until I bought new (better) blades and moved my experimental flying to grass areas. That's how I know Smile.

PS. You can't fly a Blade heli on Futaba. I had to buy a Spektrum DX4e. There I learned the art of binding Spektrums. I have rebound (?) that radio about 100 times now. Hmmm.


RE: Radio's - corsair_pilot - 08-03-2012

Hahaha... I was guessing it would've been something like that.
I think that was something I passed onto my Dad, find more room, like a nice big grassy area!
Will mention the new blades etc, I'm sure that will help him out.
It's certainly a learning curve for both of us